Incels cannot find solace among MRAs, Incel on incel hate

16 09 2013

It has come to my attention that many incels such as myself wanted to seek out support and a sense of belonging amongst MRAs and MGTOWs, as involuntary celibacy is indeed something that primarily affects heterosexual men. However, little do they know that us incels CANNOT find belonging amongst MRAs and MGTOWs for one simple reason: They fear that if they accept us incels, their issues, problems and their claims will not be taken seriously by society as “bitter because they can’t get laid”.

However, there will come a day where involuntary celibacy will be taken seriously by society… the same way Jews are taken seriously by the Nazis. As incels have notorious reputations of becoming rampaging shooters (George Sodini, Cho Seung Hui, Jared Lee Loughner, etc ), men like us will no doubt be scrutinized by the law to be potential threats. Many incels indeed has no where else to turn to for support, as admitting this problem will end up ostracized by society.

Aside from seeking out prostitution for release, we incels must support each other to prevent future Sodinis and Loughners from happening. As this blog was trolled by a poster from PUA Hate (FYI, NOT the commenter on the previous entry), who were probably just as incel as I am, I must say all the incel on incel hate must stop. Lending a helping hand and offer constructive criticism might be beneficial for everyone…instead of being a dick for the sake of being a dick so you can feel better about yourself temporarily by putting down other incels who are in the same situation as you are. Just a suggestion

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38 responses

17 09 2013
genderneutrallanguage

I think your going about it wrong. Do you know the BIG difference between incels and MGTOW? Objectification and choice. Incels are self objectifying and failing to make their situation one of choice. MGTOW Choose. Most of us CHOOSE celibacy because sex just isn’t worth the risk. You too can make the choice to be celibate. If it is YOUR choice it gives YOU power. It doesn’t matter if ‘they’ don’t want you if their approve doesn’t matter. Do for you and you will be much happier. Keep chasing tail, and your just setting yourself up to be the whipping boy of any girl that cares to manipulate you.

I’m not suprized that you got flack from MRA and MGTOW. Feminism is the belief that the world acts upon women. This is just stupid. incel is the belief that the world acts upon you. You are an actor. You are an agent. To be involuntary anything is to hand over you agency like the feminists do. So, no you don’t fit with MRA or MGTOW. Take ownership of your celibacy, make it a choice YOU MAKE and you will be MGTOW.

17 09 2013
survivingincel

what makes you think the world doesn’t act upon you? Many Incels are decent human beings trotted upon by this society simply because our sick culture does not favor decent individuals. Secondly, incelibacy is also a product of modern radical feminism, where the productive provider is no longer needed. In order to be successful in the dating market, you have to be either a psychotic criminal bad boy or a sexy stud. decent men are neither. If we are allies in combating radical feminism, why should MRAs push us away?

women do the choosing on the dating market, you cannot take control unless they chose you first

18 09 2013
genderneutrallanguage

Women do choose on the dating market. This does not mean that women have all the power. Take yourself off the market and they have no power over you at all.

The world does act upon you. You also get to act back. You make choices, make the choices matter.

One of the bigest problems with feminism isn’t the focus on women, but the perpetual victimization of women. Incel is the same thing for men. You are not an allie in combating radical feminism. You are a radical feminist.

18 09 2013
survivingincel

If you think I am a radical feminist, you missed the whole point of the blog and you are completely insane

18 09 2013
genderneutrallanguage

Your core philosophy and the core philosophy of radical feminists are the same. I’m a victim and it’s the other gender’s fault. You are a radical feminist.

18 09 2013
Franklin

Please keep it up genderneutrallanguage. I want all incels to know what jerks MGTOW are.

18 09 2013
survivingincel

so stating the fact that involuntary celibacy is caused by radical feminism makes me a radical feminist? does that mean MRAs are radical feminists too?

18 09 2013
genderneutrallanguage

In many cases yes. This is the biggest problem Men’s rights faces. When “radical feminism” is presented as an oppressive system that keeps men down, involuntary celebecy, Gynocracy, or what ever. This is not gender equality but a re branding of Patriarchy.

17 09 2013
Franklin

I disagree with this article and with genderneutrallanguage’s comment. The issue has nothing to do with MRAs, MGTOW, or incel. The issue is simply modern culture. Members of modern culture are entirely selfish and without morality. They would never do anything to help another man or to seek truth. Their forums only exist to feed their own egos. This applies to all modernist groups including MRAs, MGTOW, and incels. Incels are an embarrassment to MGTOW who like to feel empowered (even though they aren’t) just like feminists. genderneutrallanguage’s comment is a smokescreen. I have been banned from every MRA and MGTOW forum because my CHOICE differs from their CHOICE. And my situation certainly is one of choice. I also disagree with the idea in the blog post that “there will come a day where involuntary celibacy will be taken seriously by society”. Incel will never be taken seriously because that would violate liberal (false) assumptions. Incels will just be called crazy and will be ignored until such people are bred out of the population. And finally, incels will never help each other as long as they remain part of modern culture. Just look at what was, until recently, the most active incel forum to see what I mean. The only way for men to cooperate on anything is for them to reject modern culture and to join a culture that supports cooperation.

18 09 2013
survivingincel

are incels part of modern culture? thats the whole point of this entry. Incels must help each other and support each other, not insult and bash other incels like they do in PUAHate. We incels ARE a culture of our own, because we are ostracized by modern society.

I already gave the reason why one day we will be taken seriously by society, as long as there are Sodinis and Loughners out there, we will not always be ignored.

18 09 2013
Franklin

Incels are not their own culture. Incel is just one specific attribute of a man. Just look at the incels on the incel forum that we both know. Do all those people belong to one culture? I don’t think so. Some try to fit in to modern culture and some just drop out and have no culture.

Cases like Sodini only arouse interest in bored rich countries like America. In Mexico where gang members shoot people up every day, Sodini would be hardly noticed. And this is the future for America, increased violence with obscure issues like incel becoming increasingly irrelevant.

18 09 2013
survivingincel

on that forum, many of us are bond together by a common set of beliefs and we share surprisingly similar world view, doesn’t that mean we are part of a sub culture?

America has incel epidemic, does Mexico have it?

18 09 2013
Franklin

What I used to like about that forum was the diversity of views, that’s what set it apart from the mainstream which is homogeneously modernistic. That diversity is gone now, and it too is mostly modernistic.

Mexico has some incel now though it isn’t as visible and is mostly among lower class men. In Mexico, money solves incel.

18 09 2013
survivingincel

in the west, incel can also be solved by becoming a handsome psychopath

23 09 2013
mike

I dont know your views that much but you can just leave your country and go somewhere else. Where you think you can get laid, and have a normal life. You will not change your society, just move and bang girls in other places.

24 09 2013
survivingincel

this has been discussed before. I would very much like to go abroad.

30 09 2013
Elijah

Nah, chasing after women in different countries wont help you. Get yourself together here at home. You cant boarder jump your issues away.

3 10 2013
survivingincel

many incels are in fact incel because of issues thats out of our control, because we live in a hostile society here in the west

30 09 2013
Elijah

Bruh, this whole “we incels have to stick together” thing is weak.

Thats part of your problem; youre need others as a crutch. Yes, this is difficult, but its not going to get better by hanging out with like minded, depressed individuals.s. What can other incels offer you? Nothing, thats what.

Changing your mindset is the first step. Stop surrounding yourself and crying out for other timid, sexually frustrated individuals. Theyll only do you more harm than good.

30 09 2013
Elijah

I meant to say “you need others as a crutch”

3 10 2013
survivingincel

incels hating on other incels for no reason, like members from PUAHate, doesn’t help anyone either

3 10 2013
Franklin

Why do you call yourself “Elijah”?

16 10 2013
3rdWorldHero

I support the comment about leaving the country. We don’t look much different you and I. Ever since I left the USA, I have gotten a normal sex life and it feels like I’m living a normal life. I think you are just in an abnormal situation. Come to Asia my Asian brother, and you will regain the normalcy. I wish you luck. I added you on my links on my site:

http://3rdworldhero.blogspot.com

my email:thirdworldhero@gmail.com

16 10 2013
survivingincel

thank you brother

5 11 2013
P Ray

Come to Asia my Asian brother, and you will regain the normalcy.
Note that:
1. unless you are going to Asia on an expat wage scale, you will be paid as much as a local,
2. work conditions worldwide for ANYONE who is an employee have gotten MUCH worse.
see:
smh.com.au/executive-style/management/comment-is-our-workplace-culture-broken-20131022-2vxhe.html

and
puahate.com/showthread.php?t=86805

I live in China now and have lived in South Korea and the Philippines recently. I’ve been to Japan a couple of times. I can only tell you about the places I know….(tldr warning)….

South Korea – Rude and racist. The majority of Koreans will not like you simply due to the color of your skin and the fact that you’re not Korean. Unfortunately for (mostly) male Koreans, however (at least in their xenophobic eyes), they can’t convince a large amount of “their women” to hate foreigners as much as they do. Studying English is chic there, so you won’t do too badly with the females as long as you look decent (Koreans are some of the most vain people I’ve ever met – decent level of looks required). Other than that, living is okay – it’s very clean and safe, but you will miss many creature comforts from home (like top shelf liquor – Koreans hate real competition from foreigners, so they impose crazy tariffs on it and many other things like it). Korean-against-foreigner scamming often happens (usually in the form of “I won’t pay you for the work you did”), so beware. And most of the food is not that great. I’ve already told friends and family that I will not return. I don’t buy Korean products and never will again.

China – Almost any foreigner can do well with females, but their are two kinds of females here – westernized and non-westernized. Even here in Shanghai, many of them are still non-westernized, so you’d likely be dealing with unshaven armpit hair (I’ve seen this too many times to be joking), smelly poon, and sometimes bad breath (the bad breath was a huge culture shock when I came here – I still can’t get over it). The westernized ones range from okay to stunning. Living here is a mix – you have shitty air, water, and food quality, but you can get most of your creature comforts taken care of. There’s still a lot of scamming going on (i.e. tell you it’s one thing and charge you the corresponding price, but it’s another), but it can be avoided with careful attention. Personally, I don’t see myself staying here more than 10 years – as soon as my company has an opening my level of the organization, I’ll be transferring to another part of the world (preferably not Asia – it’s starting to wear on me, quite frankly).

The Philippines – Due to economic hardships, foreigners obviously do very well with women there, and I’d say the women are worth it (as long as you are careful, some are good at pulling the wool over a man’s eyes and can suck you dry without remorse). The only problem is actually living there – it’s almost impossible to do if you don’t already have a fixed income. There is no economy to speak of, so they don’t exactly have jobs coming out of their ears, and the government is shitty, so jumping through the hoops is even worse. Also, the infrastructure is shit (due to the terrible government – it is literally the worse country I’ve lived in to this day), so expect flooding, rolling black-outs…you name it. Outside of the “resort”-y areas, it’s mostly squalor – trash everywhere. And Filipino males are a bunch of unemployed douchebag gangster wannabes (if young) or unemployed lazy douchebags (if older). And don’t let the Catholic piety fool you – everybody in the PI can kill, steal, etc. with the best of them. Lying to get what you want is common, so you will have to guard yourself around everyone you meet. The food is also pretty damn good.

Japan – I’ve only visited on a couple of occasions, but it seems like the best part of Asia. Decent on women and quality of life, but no individual category is worth writing home about. From what I’ve heard outside of that, opinions range from “good, but a bit racist” to “you will always get a fair shake.” One good thing about Japan is the lack of scamming – it’s one of the few places in Asia where you will get the same price and quality as a local with no haggling (believe me – this is not the standard in Asia).

Overall, Asia is a good place to experience, but it will distort your reality. If you’re looking for tang, you’ll find it, but it isn’t as satisfying. I’m almost 30 years old and, since my 18th birthday, I’ve only spent a total of three years in the West. The other nine? Fuckin’ Asia. I’m definitely better in many ways (I didn’t marry a fucking white girl from back home that will just get fat and bitchy five years after marriage – I married a model that has kept her shape even after popping out my kid), but it didn’t come without some hassle in other areas.

If you want some legit advice – then stop worrying about chicks. Pussy ain’t worth it and, when they see you realize that, women will fall in line.

23 12 2013
IDontHaveAName

They may or may not fall in line.

24 12 2013
tyrionl annister

I agree, I would advocate all men who aren’t finding who/what they are looking for in their own country/culture, to broaden their search parameters. I would go further, and suggest that all incel men living in wester countries, (if they have of course a good-paying job and economic resources to finance a life project) keep an open mind and consider the option of interacting with women from other cultures, and see where it goes.

Yes, foreign marriage opportunities, but it is not necesary to leaving your own country. You can bring a mail order bride through international marriage agencies. There are plenty of international marriage agencies that are often affiliated with web-based dating sites that are able to market their services on a larger scale. Most of women registered in foreing marriage agencies want to escape their present way of living, gain financial security and see what life out their frontiers can offer them, so they do not share the same frame of reference as in developed world populations (and thus, the forces of balancing selection provide opportunistic niches in the form of outgroup-seeking females).

18 12 2013
K C Sunbeam

These terms MGTOW, incel and so forth are brand new to me; I find them interesting. I’m in a similar situation to these groups. I’ve written extensively on Staying Single, Social Problems, Feminism, and suchlike.
My website is http://www.wowedbytruth.com

If anyone would be interested in reading my material and commenting as to how I can better present my information, what info I should delete, or what info I may have overlooked, please let me know.

18 12 2013
survivingincel

the idea of being incel is not quantum mechanics here. the social interaction is not as complex as the politically correct people want you to believe.

look good, be an asshole, and you will get laid

be ugly and a nice guy you don’t get laid

18 12 2013
Franklin

Your website looks interesting but I have 2 complaints. One is that you use PDFs. There are good tools to convert PDF to HTML and HTML is easier to read in a browser. The other is that I wish there was a summary. The intro is just a teaser but I wish it said more.

I am also interested in religion and my website is http://www.biblicjudaism.org/

20 12 2013
K C Sunbeam

Thank you gentlemen, for your replies.

survivingincel: I agree, being incel should be simple. But I would say: be a bad guy with lots of money=you’ll get the woman. And nice guys finish last. However, this life is short, and it’s not worth it to be a bad guy.

Franklin:
I’m computer illiterate; I don’t know my rear from a hole in the ground when it comes to computers. My dad and I just paid this guy 700 dollars for this setup. We already went through a list of two dozen other companies in our area; all we’re out of business, their phone was out of order or didn’t respond, or they charged thousands!

I didn’t intend for my intro to be a “teaser.” I purposely avoided going into specific issues in my intro because my subjects are so controversial. I don’t want to tip my cards right away, so they think “He’s for or against such and such, forget this guy.

So far, I don’t know of a better way to go about it, nor can I solve my computer problems at this juncture. I shall take a look at your website.

21 12 2013
bb

“They fear that if they accept us incels, their issues, problems and their claims will not be taken seriously by society as “bitter because they can’t get laid”.”

No, it is because incels go directly against the first rule of MGTOW by their mere definition. You seek female validation to account for your own self worth (ex “my weight loss progress to get a girl.” instead of “my weight loss progress to stop having a heart attack everytime I try to climb onto a bus” ), MGTOW BY ITS MERE DEFINITION exudes soreveignity and self ownership, you are the one validating your own worth.

The manosphere is also overall against pedestalization of women, while funny enough, tends towards pedestalizing the few women who post crap around, most of it except, you guessed it, MGTOW, who just doesn’t give a shit about what women have to say at all.

Volcels can be MGTOW, in fact many hardcore MGTOWs are (I personally go with prostitutes to give my fleshlights a break) but incels, unless they are gay incels, are certainly against anything the manosphere has to say, in fact most male Feminists (the ones without power to explouit the hypergamic nature of women) ARE incel…

So no, we are not going to support your longing for pussy because you, by your own definition, are an enemy. Once you manage to stop behaving like a monkey in heat and take a hold on your instincts and become a rational human being, then you would be welcome, but for that you should learn the meaning of self respect.

22 12 2013
survivingincel

How am I an enemy of MGTOW, when I speak against social injustice of feminism just as the MGTOW do? Do I sound like a male feminist?

you are no better than the feminists you speak against. You don’t need validation because you already had it.

22 12 2013
Franklin

More MGTOW bullshit. Half the MGTOW are PUAs and no one seeks female validation more than a PUA.

12 01 2014
blah

Male feminists are incel? Bullshit. In my experience most male feminists are pussy whipped husbands and boyfriends or the ones few who found his true soul mate at 18 and has been happy ever since, and literally cannot understand why men less fortunate than him can possibly have something bad to say about gender relations.

If I tried to force myself to not want what I want because I can’t get it, then it’s scarcely empowering. Guess some MGTOWs have fooled themselves that they don’t want it because they don’t and not because they can’t get it, kinda like when you see someone, usually on TV saying, “FINE! I didn’t want to be in your stupid club ANYWAY!”

And it’s not about being a monkey. Getting laid actually doesn’t help. It’s about not wanting the slow decline to absolute oblivion in which you have not a single soul to talk to. Being an only child with older parents, no extended family and shit at making friends I will end up pretty much forgetting how to form words I’d be so alone. The main fucked up thing about our society is that the only fate for someone who doesn’t settle down and get married is:
a) become a player- it’ll at least give you something to do but won’t, unless you are hugh hefner, last until you’re 80.
b) get progressively more and more miserable.
And no social movement can change that. The only thing that could change that would be if, say, 5% of the population has no success dating for their whole lives instead of a negligible minority.

And ok just have to add this put not direct reply to previous poster – all the perverted weirdness about getting laid abroad on this thread really seems bizarre to me. Outside the western world people are, by and large, 10 times more racist, 10 times more obsessed with how much you earn and what you look like, and with 10 times the absolute social dictatorship in which you have to marry at a certain age have kids at a certain age have a certain job etc. etc. The only men moving abroad are perverts who think primarily about getting laid or weirdos who have gone off western women because they actually want to, you know, have jobs of their own and not bind their feet up to make them smaller or some shit like that. Who else would want a relationship with someone you can’t even talk to properly and who just sees you as the embodiment of the west rather than a person?

16 08 2015
Steel

Can a guy still be considered incel if he refuses obese girls? Because obese girls have lower standards and will flirt with almost anyone, which basically means that male celibacy is technically always voluntary.

16 08 2015
survivingincel

some guys do get rejected by obese girls. Obese girls get hit on by desperate guys, not the other way around

29 10 2016
Lonesome 30

“Because obese girls have lower standards and will flirt with almost anyone”
become chubby and you’ll see that isn’t true at all,even fat women now have options while an obese guy gets nothing

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